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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by bodybuilder22 View Post
    if you don't feel its affecting you don't you make the goddamn surgery my whole life is ruined, I was successful engineer, thought it would raise the testosterone levels and have a better focus, concentration etc.., now everything is ruined I just hope I can get back to normal

    and remember,

    most of the doctors search for money not your health, once you are cut you will never get back to normal
    Hey man,

    I don`t even know if I have it and don`t really suspect I do. It was just suggested to me as an option, so I will take an ultrasound for a complete bodycheck including my ballsack.

    I`m sorry to hear you`re not feeling well, but I`m confident you`ll figure it out. There is help to get.

    But I`m interested in hearing how you found out that you had it? Were you experiencing low testosterone issues or testicular shrinkage?

    Thanks for your input,

    Elijah

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
    Hey man,

    I don`t even know if I have it and don`t really suspect I do. It was just suggested to me as an option, so I will take an ultrasound for a complete bodycheck including my ballsack.

    I`m sorry to hear you`re not feeling well, but I`m confident you`ll figure it out. There is help to get.

    But I`m interested in hearing how you found out that you had it? Were you experiencing low testosterone issues or testicular shrinkage?

    Thanks for your input,

    Elijah
    It was figured out by the doctor then by doppler check, it was grade 2, but I didn't really feel its big or something, I just felt a little pain from time to time

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by bodybuilder22 View Post
    It was figured out by the doctor then by doppler check, it was grade 2, but I didn't really feel its big or something, I just felt a little pain from time to time
    I have surgery to repair a varicocele coming up. I thought all along that it was a very safe procedure with minimal complications. Now I'm worried. Do you mind explaining what exactly happened that resulted in losing a testicle?

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by flashrad55 View Post
    I have surgery to repair a varicocele coming up. I thought all along that it was a very safe procedure with minimal complications. Now I'm worried. Do you mind explaining what exactly happened that resulted in losing a testicle?
    It was done by a professor in the faculty of medicine, but with pare hands, no microsurgery, I think microsurgery is a better option if its really needed

    if not urgent I don't recommend it at all, its nothing that will lead to complete misery

    pay as much as you can to get best medical care, you only have two balls, and only one chance in life

  5. #25
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    make sure you are in a clean place, testicles are very sensetive organs that will go to atrophy from the a little infection

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by bodybuilder22 View Post
    It was figured out by the doctor then by doppler check, it was grade 2, but I didn't really feel its big or something, I just felt a little pain from time to time
    Thank you for your input.

    Actually, I`ve been feeling a dull ache in my testicles, but I reasoned it was because of wearing tight jeans.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by flashrad55 View Post
    I have surgery to repair a varicocele coming up. I thought all along that it was a very safe procedure with minimal complications. Now I'm worried. Do you mind explaining what exactly happened that resulted in losing a testicle?
    Do you mind me asking how you were diagnosed and what kind of symptoms you are experiencing? Are these the same as low testosterone issues? Is the idea that repairing the varicocele will get you back in business so to speak?

    Thanks.

    Elijah

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
    Do you mind me asking how you were diagnosed and what kind of symptoms you are experiencing? Are these the same as low testosterone issues? Is the idea that repairing the varicocele will get you back in business so to speak?

    Thanks.

    Elijah
    I diagnosed it myself (it was visible and obvious) and it was confirmed by a doctor. I haven't experienced any significant symptoms. Occasionally there will be a dull ache. The main reason I was planning to get it repaired was there is quite a bit of evidence that testosterone improves after repair (especially for a grade III varicocele), it can negatively effect fertility, and I just didn't like how it felt and looked. I am relatively young so I figured I might as well have it repaired to avoid any problems down the road. There are several different techniques that are used to repair it. Microsurgery does appear to be the best option.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by flashrad55 View Post
    I diagnosed it myself (it was visible and obvious) and it was confirmed by a doctor. I haven't experienced any significant symptoms. Occasionally there will be a dull ache. The main reason I was planning to get it repaired was there is quite a bit of evidence that testosterone improves after repair (especially for a grade III varicocele), it can negatively effect fertility, and I just didn't like how it felt and looked. I am relatively young so I figured I might as well have it repaired to avoid any problems down the road. There are several different techniques that are used to repair it. Microsurgery does appear to be the best option.
    YOU ARE VERY WISE TO DO RESEARCH ON YOUR OWN, INSTEAD OF JUST TAKING DOC'S WORD ON THINGS...i was very involved with setting up my trt plan with doc!!!! the important thing is to find a doc who takes your input seriously, imo.

  10. #30
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    I'm 30, I had suspected for a long time I had low testosterone (lifting 4 years, hardly any gains). Got my own bloodwork done, 317ng/dl. This is with never running any AAS, SARMs or any "natty" supps. So I said, heck with it, I'll just do my own TRT (I don't like being monitored by docs). I ran a cycle, it was the best 8 weeks of my life. Gone was the anxiety, depression, feeling of worthlessness, low self esteem, nervous around important people... I could go on. All those feeling stopped within a few hours of my first 350mg sustanon injection. Looking back, I know I had low test all through college, all through high school.... I wish I had been tested, I would have rather 2x week (or 1x) injections for the rest of my life than living the way the last 20 years or so has been. It was that night and day.

    My quality of life is 1000x better. I'm calmer, more productive at work, I don't ever get nervous, never at a loss for words... If any of these symptoms ring true with you, consider TRT. Nobody should have to live the life I was living (suicidal thoughts on and off for 15-20 years). Now I feel like a king all the time.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtrain View Post
    I'm 30, I had suspected for a long time I had low testosterone (lifting 4 years, hardly any gains). Got my own bloodwork done, 317ng/dl. This is with never running any AAS, SARMs or any "natty" supps. So I said, heck with it, I'll just do my own TRT (I don't like being monitored by docs). I ran a cycle, it was the best 8 weeks of my life. Gone was the anxiety, depression, feeling of worthlessness, low self esteem, nervous around important people... I could go on. All those feeling stopped within a few hours of my first 350mg sustanon injection. Looking back, I know I had low test all through college, all through high school.... I wish I had been tested, I would have rather 2x week (or 1x) injections for the rest of my life than living the way the last 20 years or so has been. It was that night and day.

    My quality of life is 1000x better. I'm calmer, more productive at work, I don't ever get nervous, never at a loss for words... If any of these symptoms ring true with you, consider TRT. Nobody should have to live the life I was living (suicidal thoughts on and off for 15-20 years). Now I feel like a king all the time.

    Its the stigma of test that probably sways the doc from doing this.. Or perhaps the truth that normal test levels cure a lot of illnesses lol. Either way good job in taking your life into your own hands.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrag View Post
    Its the stigma of test that probably sways the doc from doing this.. Or perhaps the truth that normal test levels cure a lot of illnesses lol. Either way good job in taking your life into your own hands.
    Thanks for the kind words. I think many people who are depressed, anxiety, etc actually have low (er) testosterone, and they're not going to know for sure without bloodwork done. The only way I knew was by doing a lot of research, which led me to believe I had low testosterone later confirmed with bloodwork. I did go see a urologist about my low testosterone. I gave him a copy of the labcorp bloodwork I had done on my own, I said "everything looked good, but the testosterone looked a little low but in range," (at 317ng/dl, it was above the 250 labcorp cutoff). I was hoping he'd correct me saying, "yes, its technically in range, but since you're more than 2.5 standard deviations from the average of 724, so you would benefit from TRT." http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/96/8/2430.abstract Though I didn't want TRT, because of the monitoring, but I wanted him to check me out and see if something else was wrong. But all he said was "yeah, 317 is in range, looks good to me."

    Reading some threads on TRT, it seems like many of the MD's just don't have a depth of knowledge in the subject. They don't seem to very often "fix" the underlying issue, or even try and diagnose it, they usually just prescribe test-c if you're in your 30's or older and be done with it. I was hoping the urologist would mention something about me having primary hypogonadism, because my LH and FSH were middle to upper range, just low testosterone (indicating problems with the leydig cells production despite seeing the signaling from LH). The guys just learning about hormones in the threads I'm reading seem to know more than the docs they're describing, which is sad to me. When I was seeing my GP to get a referal to the urologist, the GP actually said "you sound like you know more than I about this," with a smile. I think its just that most GP's are fighting the worst fires (diabetes, obesity, old people problems) and this isn't even on their radar. Go in with blood sugar in the 90s, and you'll get every pamphlet they have. Go in with test in the 3-400s, and you'll be told everything looks good.

    I also read in threads about how the docs see someone on TRT in the 1000+ ng/dl range and freak out, dialing way back the dose. Other than prostate enlargement (which I theorize could be reduced with replacing some of the test in TRT with tren, at very low doses because of the lack of reduction to DHT), what are the downsides to too high of a testosterone level? I know it raise hemoglobin and hematocrit, which can lead to circulation problems and clotting issues, but as long as those are kept somewhat in check, its just carrying more oxygen in the bloodstream IMHO. Most of the other sides come from too much test aromatization into estrogen.

    So far, only sides I'm seeing on high test levels (I'm guessing based on my dose, I'm in the 2500-3000ng/dl range), is feeling of wellbeing, calmness, clarity of thought, excellent gains at the gym, able to run faster/further without running out of breath, and increased productivity at work.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtrain View Post
    Thanks for the kind words. I think many people who are depressed, anxiety, etc actually have low (er) testosterone, and they're not going to know for sure without bloodwork done. The only way I knew was by doing a lot of research, which led me to believe I had low testosterone later confirmed with bloodwork. I did go see a urologist about my low testosterone. I gave him a copy of the labcorp bloodwork I had done on my own, I said "everything looked good, but the testosterone looked a little low but in range," (at 317ng/dl, it was above the 250 labcorp cutoff). I was hoping he'd correct me saying, "yes, its technically in range, but since you're more than 2.5 standard deviations from the average of 724, so you would benefit from TRT." http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/96/8/2430.abstract Though I didn't want TRT, because of the monitoring, but I wanted him to check me out and see if something else was wrong. But all he said was "yeah, 317 is in range, looks good to me."

    Reading some threads on TRT, it seems like many of the MD's just don't have a depth of knowledge in the subject. They don't seem to very often "fix" the underlying issue, or even try and diagnose it, they usually just prescribe test-c if you're in your 30's or older and be done with it. I was hoping the urologist would mention something about me having primary hypogonadism, because my LH and FSH were middle to upper range, just low testosterone (indicating problems with the leydig cells production despite seeing the signaling from LH). The guys just learning about hormones in the threads I'm reading seem to know more than the docs they're describing, which is sad to me. When I was seeing my GP to get a referal to the urologist, the GP actually said "you sound like you know more than I about this," with a smile. I think its just that most GP's are fighting the worst fires (diabetes, obesity, old people problems) and this isn't even on their radar. Go in with blood sugar in the 90s, and you'll get every pamphlet they have. Go in with test in the 3-400s, and you'll be told everything looks good.

    I also read in threads about how the docs see someone on TRT in the 1000+ ng/dl range and freak out, dialing way back the dose. Other than prostate enlargement (which I theorize could be reduced with replacing some of the test in TRT with tren, at very low doses because of the lack of reduction to DHT), what are the downsides to too high of a testosterone level? I know it raise hemoglobin and hematocrit, which can lead to circulation problems and clotting issues, but as long as those are kept somewhat in check, its just carrying more oxygen in the bloodstream IMHO. Most of the other sides come from too much test aromatization into estrogen.

    So far, only sides I'm seeing on high test levels (I'm guessing based on my dose, I'm in the 2500-3000ng/dl range), is feeling of wellbeing, calmness, clarity of thought, excellent gains at the gym, able to run faster/further without running out of breath, and increased productivity at work.
    i agree 100% about doc's not being up to date about trt....i have always said that finding the right doc that is willing to work with you and listen to your input with an open mind is the key!!!!!

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by flashrad55 View Post
    I diagnosed it myself (it was visible and obvious) and it was confirmed by a doctor. I haven't experienced any significant symptoms. Occasionally there will be a dull ache. The main reason I was planning to get it repaired was there is quite a bit of evidence that testosterone improves after repair (especially for a grade III varicocele), it can negatively effect fertility, and I just didn't like how it felt and looked. I am relatively young so I figured I might as well have it repaired to avoid any problems down the road. There are several different techniques that are used to repair it. Microsurgery does appear to be the best option.
    Appreciate the input.

    Let us know how things turn out for you.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtrain View Post
    My quality of life is 1000x better. I'm calmer, more productive at work, I don't ever get nervous, never at a loss for words... If any of these symptoms ring true with you, consider TRT. Nobody should have to live the life I was living (suicidal thoughts on and off for 15-20 years). Now I feel like a king all the time.
    Thank you for sharing your input, dtrain. Glad to hear things turned out better for you.

    I`ve been having issues myself for several years now, mostly related to low libido, physical fatigue, tiredness and lack of energy. I have notice that I have a lot of resistance against going on TRT, but lately I`ve been considering to just say "fuck it" and give it a try.

    Do you mind sharing some good resources on TRT that you found helpful? Do you use HCG?

    Thanks,

    Elijah

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
    Thank you for sharing your input, dtrain. Glad to hear things turned out better for you.

    I`ve been having issues myself for several years now, mostly related to low libido, physical fatigue, tiredness and lack of energy. I have notice that I have a lot of resistance against going on TRT, but lately I`ve been considering to just say "fuck it" and give it a try.

    Do you mind sharing some good resources on TRT that you found helpful? Do you use HCG?

    Thanks,

    Elijah
    Most will tell you to hold off as long as possible. I'm not sure the reason behind this to be honest, if test is low and not able to be brought back up, there's no sense in living a poor quality of life just to get a few years out of the old testes. Many say its a life decision, as once you start, there's no turning back. I'm not sure when the hypothalamus and anterior pituitary starts to get messed up (atrophied probably) from being being shut off for so long. To me, that's that's the real drawback of TRT. The other downside is testicular atrophy, which as you mentioned, there's HCG for. I use 250IU twice a week. Something to remember, HCG stimulates the leydig cells 24/7 until the levels are insignificant, whereas LH comes in pulses. Its somewhat easy to overdue HCG. Many use 1000IU a week, I think that's too much. 500/wk seems like the best IMO. Plenty of men inseminate women on HCG, so it does work. Not sure how though, I always thought FSH was critical to sperm production, but apparently not (which makes me wonder, what is FSH's purpose?).

    The resources I've used are mainly steroid boards. Not sure if I should link to those here. I can PM you some better sites. A gun site I visit has a thread that has some good info. Its mainly guys who don't work out, so its a good place to get started as the info is basic, but there is some bad info inthere. Luckily, people chime in to correct the misinformation. http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/827..._.html&page=41

    I'm tossing around the idea of coming off this TRT and seeing if my natural system can be restarted, but I don't like the timespan it would take:

    -Stop pinning, let 2 weeks go by to let natural levels come down. I would pin HCG during this time (hcg has a 4.5day half life, so I would actually stop probably at day 8 or 10).
    -My test levels should be < 200ng/dl at that point, and hcg almost out, so I can jumpstart the HPTAxis with nolvadex (which worked when I ran a cycle in sept of 2011).
    -Run nolva for 3-5 days (keeping the run short, as antagonizing estrogen receptor stops satellite cell activation- see suppversity's entry on "Are you SERMing away your results?")
    - Be on natural for a few weeks to revitalize the parts of hypothalamus and anterior pituitary responsible for GnRH and LH production.

    But that's a good month of hell, and for not much gain. My HPTA will be kept from atrophying, but at this point, I don't ever think my natural production will go above 400ng/dl no matter what I do. My blood test from last year before my first cycle indicated 317ng/dl testosterone, ...well here it is

    http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/4...odworkcopy.jpg

    You can see estrogen is ideal in the low 20s, so I'm not aromatizing all my test away. My LH is mid range, but I've heard that's a bad indicator as LH comes in pulses (goes up and down quite a bit throughout the day). FSH is much more steady, and that is fairly low in my case. Ignore the white blood cell issues, the % doesn't matter if the total white blood cell count is low (said the general practitioner).

    So although I toyed with the idea of coming off TRT just to keep everything "alive." I think the downsides aren't worth it. I'm on TRT for life IMO. Hopefully someday SARMs will come through (and not be weak like ostarine or S4, where it felt like it didn't do hardly anything).

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtrain View Post
    So, although I toyed with the idea of coming off TRT just to keep everything "alive." I think the downsides aren't worth it. I'm on TRT for life IMO. Hopefully someday SARMs will come through (and not be weak like ostarine or S4, where it felt like it didn't do hardly anything).
    It would be interesting to hear what you decide to do and how it turns out.

    Are your issues primary or secondary?

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elijah View Post
    It would be interesting to hear what you decide to do and how it turns out.

    Are your issues primary or secondary?
    Primary. Not sure at this point what caused it. Seems to be a long term low grade infection or prostate inflammation. I'm guessing I was low all my life and this pushed me even lower.

    There doesn't seem to be much doctors do to fix primary. My doc gave me an antibiotic, which helped a little but as soon as the course was over it came back. Then he treated me for prostatitis, using an NSAID. That hasn't worked either.

    My body's immune system is strange. Some of my cuts heal very fast and never get infected. Like my hands, I could get a big cut then the next day its almost gone. Then other spots on my body, I have acne that's been around for 6 months with no signs of getting better. I was taking 4 fish oil pills per day, then I learned the EPA buildup harms t and b cells, so I dropped it to 1 per day. Seems like that's helped a tiny bit, but hasn't gotten rid of the protstate/uti problem or the acne. And I've been using benzoyl peroxide. Also doing intermittent fasting, so that should be helping my immune. So far haven't seen any huge improvements.

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    hey guys, I healed thank god, but I can't bodybuild anymore, the stupid doctor tied the main artry and everytime I try to carry anything heave I feel its gonna explode inside me causing internal bleeding
    psychologically I didn't heal and I feel like my life is ruined, anybody can help me pass this

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    Quote Originally Posted by bodybuilder22 View Post
    hey guys, I healed thank god, but I can't bodybuild anymore, the stupid doctor tied the main artry and everytime I try to carry anything heave I feel its gonna explode inside me causing internal bleeding
    psychologically I didn't heal and I feel like my life is ruined, anybody can help me pass this
    dude...you have got to go slow and build yourself up. start out like a noob and go from there.

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