User Tag List

Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    Proven Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    42
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default My planned fasting and nutrition protocol

    So I have a diet planned. It is pretty complex. And it is not for the faint of heart.

    But I have to point out- I did interval fasting before, zig zagging calories based on Tom Venuto's book. I lost about 120 lbs. It saved my ass big time. But I could never really understand how it worked or why. Well now I am sick again, because I stopped zigzagging calories, and I developed a lot of problems with food sensitivities and auto immune issues. Likely these problems are related to systemic toxicity and endocrine problems, overactive sympathetic nervous system, just general victim of industrial age to put it succinctly. We all know how effective interval fasting can be. This is because of the effect on metabolism, anabolism, and liver physiology. Unfortunately I am not a biochemist, and I never understood liver physiology and I still do not.

    Liver physiology is the key to curing your ailments. It allows you to fix immune problems, it allows you to deal with circulatory problems, it allows you to deal with heart disease, with hormonal imbalances, with depression, etc... It is your liver .. it filters your blood, your waste, your nutrients- and it is controlled by your sensitivity to food intake and your metabolism and the complete digestion of your food..

    I also watched a film called Fat Sick and Nearly Dead. It was very, very thought provoking. And yes, I am saying I see a correlation between extended fasting and interval fasting. I like the two, I like what they have to offer, but I see pros and cons for each. So I am going to augment the two and combine them...

    So here we go...

    Initially I am gonna get about a 100 bucks worth of produce and fresh spices and fresh juice them. I am going to store the container in my refridgerator, so I will not be tempted to break my fast with the excuse that I am way too lazy to go do the time consuming aggravating process of juicing produce. I am just going to grit my teeth and drink 3 or 4 liters of my uber mean green drink a day for 10 days. On the 9nth day I am going to break out the lemon, olive oil, and epson salt and purge my liver before I go to bed...and on the 10th day I will finish up the flush and the fast.

    Next starts the part of the interval fasting. I am not sure how many calories my body can handle, since it cannot handle just about any at this point without feeling massively bloated and uncomfortable. But it will be a 10 day fast. I should be pretty ravenous. So I am going to shoot for 3000 calories.

    I am going to try to eat a lot of sardines and fish, a massive amount of olive, coconut, and palm oil, a big pot of cooked vegetables of my preference, and some well soaked and cooked lentils and wild rice. I am going to attempt to eat some grass fed beef and broth. The red meat and minerals are suppose to be massively helpful for repairing metabolic and endocrine damage caused by long term nutrition deficiencies. This is still too light at this point, and too bland. So I am gonna break out the maple syrup (question is how much is just the right amount), and I am gonna shoot for at least a dozen yard eggs or farmer market eggs. No CAFO crap. I need legit paleo organic or home grown food, but I need to get dense calories that are hunger provoking. I have the appatite of someone with chronic illness. That is why it became so hard to do paleo after a year in a half. Only really unhealthy food would make me want to even eat. Imagine never ever being hungry, to the point of just not eating anymore.

    That is why I am trying to do this diet- to repair my metabolism and my health with diet, exercise, herbs, and mineral/nutrition therapy.

    I am going to eat this 3000 calorie diet for two whole days in a row, each day during an 8 hour period 16/8 style. But upon the last meal of the second day, I am going to start a 36 hour period fast. I am going to repeat the 48 hour feed period followed by the 36 hour feed period twice more. But on the third period that would be the 36 hour fast, I am going to re-initiate what will be a 3 to 5 day juice fast again. After that juice fast, I will start back over with the 48 hour re-feed period.

    My goal is weight loss, because I do have a gut. But I also have chronic fatigue. As it sounds, this is a pretty sketchy situation I am in. Calorie deprivation is nasty stuff when it gets overboard. But the juicing is too important. So I am vacillating between two very important balancing acts aimed at metabolic increase. It is sort of meant to set me back a bit each time. The juice fast is gonna hurt me some, and then the bulking is too. But there is a lot of deep healing going on too, and eventually I think I can transition to more of a genuine IF nutrition plan with less juice fasting. I am trying to deal with an autoimmune gut disorder though, so a lot of healing is required.

    So in summary that is -

    10 day juice fast
    48 hour feed period with 16/8 pattern each day
    36 hour juice fast (veg only)
    48 hour feed period with 16/8 pattern each day
    36 hour juice fast (veg only)
    48 hour feed period with 16/8 pattern each day
    3-5 day juice fast
    48 hour feed period with 16/8 pattern each day
    [/.....] ad naseum


    ----------

  2. #2
    Senior Member Benson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Times Beach, MO
    Posts
    18,195
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I also watched a film called Fat Sick and Nearly Dead.
    That was an interesting movie actually...
    Remember, believe none of what you hear and half of what you see...





  3. #3
    Member FurorGermanicus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    74
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I don't think that prolonged fasts are the way to go...seriously, that won't cut it nor do I think, that it will be very health. And well, thats no intermittent fast. Its a full fast.

  4. #4
    Senior Member sluggy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    497
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It's not really fasting now if you're drinking juice.. To be honest I think you need to re-evaluate this diet. I'm not positive there is much benefit for fasting for more than 24 hours.

  5. Likes Quinc liked this post
  6. #5
    Member AshleyMarie093's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Alaska
    Posts
    31
    Blog Entries
    1
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    " or 4 liters of my uber mean green drink a day for 10 days. On the 9nth day I am going to break out the lemon, olive oil, and epson salt and purge my liver before I go to bed...and on the 10th day I will finish up the flush and the fast. "

    Chlorophyll is a wonderful blood cleanser, fresh green juices are essential to any fast (in my experiences!)
    epson, olive oil, ect not nesessary, save yourself the $$ and effort.
    Have you a juicer? If so, buy cheap veggies (carrots, kale&collards, swiss chard) in bulk and apples &oranges, or whatever fruit you can find that is reasonably priced. juice 3x daily, take in at least 16 oz each serving.Do this for a few days, & drink lots of lemon water throughout the day. You will be weak the first day or 2 and experience detox symptoms, especially if you've never fasted before (break outs,weakness,strong bowel movements). When this wears off, you will have incredible energy. I don't think the salt and other things are necessary, that's a little overboard. I know you've probably read a lot into it but a lot of info you find out there is extreme. keep it simple and you will have greater success.

    Most important: be careful, listen to your body. Be sure to do this when you are off work and have no prior engagements.
    Any questions just ask, I'm an experienced faster
    Best,

    hesitant to point you towards literature, because it's obviously bias (looking at who funded it) but if you're interested...

    ttp://www.ispub.com/journal/the-internet-journal-of-alternative-medicine/volume-7-number-2/does-wheatgrass-juice-oxygenate-the-blood-of-resting-individuals.html

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1...?dopt=Abstract

  7. #6
    Proven Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    42
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Thank You

    this diet's "logic" is based on traditional chinese medicine and body building.

    Depending on just how bad things get I will shorten the IF periods, but not the extended fasting. That part is needed. I may be eating considerably less protein than I had planned. It is hard to say what I can get away with. Once you have toxicity to the degree that I do, your body culls meat severely because of the congestion it causes. Or another way that you can look at it is that the body will not tolerate acidic foods.

    It is not a forever situation, as many vegans make that mistake, just simply that there is some pretty complex metabolic and nutritional therapy I am going to have endure for the next 6 to 12 months.

  8. #7
    Senior Member Benson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Times Beach, MO
    Posts
    18,195
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    As that movie demonstrates, for some period of time, months even, a juice fast appears to be beneficial and effective for some individuals.
    Remember, believe none of what you hear and half of what you see...





  9. #8
    Senior Member Jakeshorts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    6,452
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I assume beneficial is not the same as ideal.

    You might not die from it, but that doesn't necessarily make it a good idea.
    Resident Badger
    Pick your poison and enjoy. John Berardi Joe DeFranco Kelly Baggett
    Metabolic Alchemy
    "There isn't guess work in anatomy, physiology, and kinesiology. It's called science." - Brett Hobel
    Jake's log -visit and criticize.

  10. #9
    Proven Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    42
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Juice fasting is sort a resort of last measures. I actually have a better nutrition protocol by Dr. Lawrence Wilson, and it goes on to suggest a paleo/body building in nature type diet. Between the "GAPS protocol", a diet like I learned with Tom Venuto, and the Wilson protocol that is sort of where I intend to head back to.

    It is hard for me to explain to paleo people why I am criticizing meat eating, or what I think I could gain from juice fasting. It depends on circumstances, the context, and the extent you are doing it to. From a body building perspective, juice fasting is terrible on anabolism. But, from a functional medicine or TCM standard it is the ideal detox. From a metabolic or orthomolecular or even specialized food sensitivty diet, it is also terrible.

    Basically I have to retrain my body to tolerate certain foods and amounts of calories, and I cannot do that until the severe deficiencies and underlying pathologies are dealt with. I am dealing with some sort of undiagnosed autoimmune gut disease, on top of fairly severe cognitive deficiencies caused by nutrition deficiences and sensitivies. Imagine having your IQ drop 30 points overnight. Well mine was not overnight, but it was a steady decline. My muscular endurance was also a steady decline. I sort of watched by body's metabolic function break down and unravel. No surprise I have looked into as much alternative therapy centered around diseases like MS, fibro, CFS, and autism.

    I realized pretty quick that throwing meat and nootropics at the problem was not addressing some unseen root cause. That root cause I suspect to be related to autoimmune and cancer like issues. Couple that with metabolic problems and nutrient deficiences, and you really have some root issues that have to be addressed.

    Personally, I think I have some pretty severe damaged caused by chronic exposure to some compounds I have taken in somehow through diet and environment during my life time. I am fairly certain that the original weight I lost was because I healed a lot of the root damage, flushed out a lot of allergens, cleared and re-calibrated my immune system, enhanced my dysfunctional circulatory and lymphatic system. Somehow this all taught my body to do a much better job of assimilating nutrients. The malabsorption was not as severe. I think a lot of the inflammation, ulcers, and lesions that I had- had healed. But then when I began to deal with college and caffeine and stress, they came back worse than ever.

    My body does not produce enzymes, bile, or HCl properly, so that is another part of the nutritional and metabolic therapy that has to be addressed. Until it is, heavy foods will digest poorly and just dump more toxic crap into my system. Badly digested food plays a huge part in these diseases, I have no doubt.

    Meat is needed to repair a lot of that damage, but so are other nutrients- so largely right now its a matter of dealing with the other stuff, herbs, medicine, supplements, w.e until I can rebuild my digestion- and digest more meat.

    I wish I could bulk and eat meat and weight train, detox, and repair long term damages and infections all at the same time, plus add in and correct nutrition absorption - all at the same time. But, really I think they have to be done in tiered steps.

  11. #10
    Senior Member adreno's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    1,944
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Right, get on it, and tell us how it goes.

  12. #11
    Senior Member Jakeshorts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    6,452
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Define "toxic crap" that's "being dumped" into your "sysem".

    This sounds like it came out of the Mercola bible. Did a holistic doctor tell you your "body does not produce enzymes, bile, or HCl properly"? Some how I doubt they did.

    Gut problems are very real. However, if someone is feeding you lines about "toxins" they clearly have no idea what they are talking about. I would encourage you to read up on some gut health articles for athlete by John Berardi. An actual doctor and actual athletic coach to the Canadian row team. Before undergoing some very extreme protocol which may or may not work/be necessary.

    As I said above, gut issues are very real. However, no one with an education is going to tell you you have too many "toxins" in your system.
    Resident Badger
    Pick your poison and enjoy. John Berardi Joe DeFranco Kelly Baggett
    Metabolic Alchemy
    "There isn't guess work in anatomy, physiology, and kinesiology. It's called science." - Brett Hobel
    Jake's log -visit and criticize.

  13. #12
    Proven Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    42
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Gastroenterological disorders are very real. Toxicology is very real. Just because naturalist throw around market lingo to push supplements (surely no other groups are guilty of doing the same), does not nullify actual toxicology as a field. People do not develop these ridiculous diseases for any reason not related to industrial developed living. I am not going to take a broccoli pill, I am going to drink about 64 ounces of real vegetables a day. There is some fairly good research on the benefits of fasting out there thankfully, so I know I am going by a whole lot more than marketing gimmicks.

    Bluntly, you are removing toxic molecules from your body. And as far as education, well that would discount how many TCM and naturopath MD's in the world? An allopathic MD wont. He will add some "toxins".

  14. #13
    Senior Member Benson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Times Beach, MO
    Posts
    18,195
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    GI problems are very real and toxicology is very real but the two are unrelated in almost all instances.

    Your body does a pretty good job of removing "toxins" all on its own and I've yet to see any empirical evidence of accumulated "toxins" in someone's digestive tract, liver, etc. that require some extrodinary effort to dislodge.

    Fasting has lots of physiological and psychological benefits that have been elucidated in solid clinical studies and I think for the right person, under the right circumstances, even an extended juice "fast" is probably not a bad idea.

    But the elimination of "toxins" is a lot of hokum IMO...right up there with "parasite removal" for 99% of people living in the Western world and consuming clean water and food.
    Remember, believe none of what you hear and half of what you see...





  15. Likes AshleyMarie093, Ex Dubio liked this post
  16. #14
    Proven Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    42
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It may have more to do with the endotoxins released by opportunistic bacterial overgrowth associated with the diseases related to IBS and chron's. And for various reasons anyone who has had a past with morbid obesity like me has large issues with controlling metabolic waste. That I have never researched well, but I obviously KNOW it works anecdotelly.

    Then again I cannot help but wonder what all the endocrine disruptor hubub points to. That subject, is direly real. I go to school with the people involved in it. But certainly, some random supplement in a health food store is not going to detox it out of the body.

    The theory behind what some of these herbs are doing may not even be well understood. But, I have no doubt that burdock root and the other herbs mixed with it such as turmeric and sheep sorrel, when taken correctly in high doses and quality concentrated teas are very, very potent medicine in general.

    Herbal supplements are sold in a rather uncompelling manner. Little capsules of powder are gank and old and useless.

    You need a water bong, a nebulizer, a concentrated tea or tincture- and very high quality sources. Some of the capsule concentrated extracts are ok, if you get a really good brand. My experience with that, is pretty hit and miss.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Planned H-drol cycle
    By a-r-a in forum Anabolic Steroids, Prohormones & Other Performance Enhancers
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: January 23rd, 2011, 10:43 PM
  2. Planned detraining
    By HeadDoc in forum General Training and Bodybuilding
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: July 4th, 2003, 05:38 AM
  3. pre/post workout nutrition protocol
    By Spencer in forum Advanced Hypothesis, Theory & Discussion
    Replies: 57
    Last Post: April 25th, 2003, 05:14 AM
  4. Need input on planned refeeds
    By Big Daddy in forum Supplements 101
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: April 1st, 2003, 02:27 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •