[D-termine]

Ok, my first delving into the land of illicit hormones kinda sucked. Test blew out my tendons, as I kinda knew it would, and I fucked up my mix of Proviron which killed my gut. Recovery took forever, two months before my balls dropped back and I was getting morning wood again. The difference between a heavy 2 month oral cycle and a moderate 4 month cycle is crazy. The latter requiring much more prep and money, both of which I ran short on in the middle.

Soooo, I'm going back to orals, for now anyways. I think I'll be running mTRN and mTST at 4mg/day for 6-8 weeks along with my TD Test, at around 250mg absorbed a week for the full 8 weeks. I'm hoping the low dose of Test will keep the recomp effects going strong, libido up, but not too high as to make my tendonitis flair up. TRN and TST should play nicely together, be liver friendly, and not too overwhelming at 4mg/day.

Thoughts, comments? I'm bored

[liorrh]

HCG?

[captainbicept]

What did you use for PCT on your first cycle?
Also, are you aware that a ten week cycle of injectable hormones, is probably safer than a six week oral cycle?

[Jay Black]

And more effective...but he's a wuss.

[avantgarde]

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience. I got some GI issues that comes and goes and it can really fuck up a diet (ie not getting the amount of calories needed) which is crucial during PCT.

What did you use for PCT ?

One issue with TD test is that you get a an unproportional increase in DHT relative to the increase in testosterone levels presumably due to high 5-AR enzyme concentrations in the skin. People on Androgel have been reporting bloodwork confirming this and some switch to injections for this very reason.

Low dosages might be allright but if you go higher - increased sebum production = acne, + bad for your prostate and hairline (although those two are debatable).

[Benson]

avantgarde, on Mar 14 2008, 04:06 PM, said:

Low dosages might be allright but if you go higher - increased sebum production = acne, + bad for your prostate and hairline (although those two are debatable).

Yeah, old guys on Andractim for HRT see no change in prostate weight...probably due to reductions in estrogen.

[avantgarde]

Yeah PA had a nice article on meso-rx "defending" DHT.

OTOH I would assume that high DHT + elevated estrogen would be a problem, add some elevated IGF-1 (from various AAS) and you got yourself
a BPH party.

[habit]

Maybe some cissus for the tendons???

And why no needles?? Skeered

Good luck...

[D-termine]

liorrh, on Mar 14 2008, 04:00 AM, said:

HCG?

Shoulda, woulda, coulda....But I didn't. Lesson learned. In fact I think it was rast4man that got me into the whole "PCT is over rated" line of thinking, but thats another story

captainbicept, on Mar 14 2008, 04:17 AM, said:

What did you use for PCT on your first cycle?
Also, are you aware that a ten week cycle of injectable hormones, is probably safer than a six week oral cycle?

I know inj is safer etc and so forth, but I just wasn't prepared to learn a whole new way of cycling at the time. As for my pct, Nolva for 5 or 6 weeks, some Activate Xtreme and CEE. Normally I throw on another item or two, but I was broke, and couldn't lift through the first 3 weeks due to the tendonitis. I know how to run a pct, but I was broke, lazy, and injured.

Jay Black, on Mar 14 2008, 04:55 AM, said:

And more effective...but he's a wuss.

This is true, but at least I can keep my original SN

avantgarde, on Mar 14 2008, 01:06 PM, said:

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience. I got some GI issues that comes and goes and it can really fuck up a diet (ie not getting the amount of calories needed) which is crucial during PCT.

One issue with TD test is that you get a an unproportional increase in DHT relative to the increase in testosterone levels presumably due to high 5-AR enzyme concentrations in the skin. People on Androgel have been reporting bloodwork confirming this and some switch to injections for this very reason.

Low dosages might be allright but if you go higher - increased sebum production = acne, + bad for your prostate and hairline (although those two are debatable).

None of those things are an issue for me, I tolerate anabolics rather well except for getting sick often. The only thing I care about is not blowing out my tendons again. Size it seems is no longer an attainable goal, so I'd rather be shredded and hard.

avantgarde, on Mar 14 2008, 02:35 PM, said:

Yeah PA had a nice article on meso-rx "defending" DHT.

OTOH I would assume that high DHT + elevated estrogen would be a problem, add some elevated IGF-1 (from various AAS) and you got yourself
a BPH party.

Don't think I'm all too worried about BPH, I'll be running some excellent ancillaries this time around

habit, on Mar 14 2008, 04:30 PM, said:

Maybe some cissus for the tendons???

And why no needles?? Skeered

Good luck...

I tried Cissus which normally fixes me right up, but this time around it was different. For the past 5 years I've been hittin the weights, this tendonitis has been an issue. Cissus was a Godsend, but now my arm hurts differently. I think all the Test I was on crossed a line, which kinda sucks, as I have another 15-20 pounds of LBM I've always wanted to walk with. I need to look into ART, which Benson has more than once advised me to do, but supps just aren't going to cut it anymore.

As for needles, slightly scared, but it's simply one more thing I'd have to add to my plate to learn, while I already have a decent stash of orals just laying around. One day, there will be some Deca or EQ paired with some yummy shit, but until I fix my arm, there is no point




All that said, what do y'all think of this cycle? Am I the only one using legal hormones anymore? I feel beyond lame here. Come on guys

[undecipherable]

Perhaps I'm out of date, but I do recall a controversy surrounding mTST and mTRN, being that nobody knew what the stuff was. Has this ever been resolved?

[D-termine]

I've no idea but they are low on sides and work rather well. Update, as per Benson's advise I'm going to see a guy about ART on Friday, he seemed pretty cool when I met him today, and the receptionist....O shit

[captainbicept]

Honestly, if you are NOT ready for needles or as you put it "to learn a new way of cycling" then you are not ready for any of this.
If you can not do just a plain simple test cycle then, I wouldnt bother with any at all.
Keep it simple sweety.