User Tag List

Results 1 to 11 of 11
  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I obviously do not belong in this forum, but I hope that you can shed some light on this intriguing discovery.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17174891

    TRPV1+ sensory neurons control beta cell stress and islet inflammation in autoimmune diabetes.
    Razavi R, Chan Y, Afifiyan FN, Liu XJ, Wan X, Yantha J, Tsui H, Tang L, Tsai S, Santamaria P, Driver JP, Serreze D, Salter MW, Dosch HM.

    Neurosciences and Mental Health Program, The Hospital for Sick Children, Research Institute, University of Toronto, Toronto, ON, Canada, M5G 1X8.

    In type 1 diabetes, T cell-mediated death of pancreatic beta cells produces insulin deficiency. However, what attracts or restricts broadly autoreactive lymphocyte pools to the pancreas remains unclear. We report that TRPV1(+) pancreatic sensory neurons control islet inflammation and insulin resistance. Eliminating these neurons in diabetes-prone NOD mice prevents insulitis and diabetes, despite systemic persistence of pathogenic T cell pools. Insulin resistance and beta cell stress of prediabetic NOD mice are prevented when TRPV1(+) neurons are eliminated. TRPV1(NOD), localized to the Idd4.1 diabetes-risk locus, is a hypofunctional mutant, mediating depressed neurogenic inflammation. Delivering the neuropeptide substance P by intra-arterial injection into the NOD pancreas reverses abnormal insulin resistance, insulitis, and diabetes for weeks. Concordantly, insulin sensitivity is enhanced in trpv1(-/-) mice, whereas insulitis/diabetes-resistant NODxB6Idd4-congenic mice, carrying wild-type TRPV1, show restored TRPV1 function and insulin sensitivity. Our data uncover a fundamental role for insulin-responsive TRPV1(+) sensory neurons in beta cell function and diabetes pathoetiology.

    As I understand it, the autoimmune theory could be wrong, and the new theory of diabetes type 1 is that the islet cells and nearby sensory neurons are merely inflamed. Injecting capsaicin depletes substance P, which results in a blockade of neurogenic inflammation and restoring these cells to normalcy. I have no idea what I'm talking about. I hope that you guys can help me figure this out, because I know that the sickness industry will not investigate this possible cure. There were studies in Canada of capsaicin injections into the pancreases of type 1 diabetic rats curing them instantly. . .a few years ago. My guess is that they were bought-out or shut-down, because diabetes is a really profitable disease to have around. There's no way that there will be further trials into this, because capsaicin isn't patentable.

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,368
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    well sensory neurons may well have evolved first, as we already suspected, in sponges, with recent discovery of cells in globules expressing neuronal markers.

    This is what we would presume to be a sensory network and one which coordinates responses to detected agents/circumstances and the chemical signalling of the community. Since sponges circulate water around, the logical way in which these cells would be first 'plugged in' to the community would be via a neuro-endocrine system.

    It seems likely that early life had bilateral symmetry, and that the globular cluster of 'sensory' neurons further developed into the Olfactory system and which also formed the eyes and centre brain. But at this early stage such globules may even have been located in the equivalent of the body, or distributed, most likely, as part of a wider neuro-endocrine system.

    But, at this stage, the ancestors of immune cells would already have existed, and co-existed with 'sensory neurons'.

    The sensory neurons most likely colated immune and other factors to determine important things like hormones, cell cycle, initiation of reproductory behavior, feeding activity, growth etc, before it got around to coordinating movement (sponges do have primitive muscle cell forms and have been observed to move, though very slowly, and by unknown mechnanisms, and it seems likely to me that sponges are very diverse in this regard, and may have become more rigid. It also seems to be that social single-celled ameoba (slime molds) may in fact be earlier and have a rather different integration of sense and movement.) The early 'brain cells' may have been networks of 'olfactory' cells with hormone production, which cooperated with immune cells. This collusion may have had a common cell origin, and as I still maintain, could have been directly derrived from an ancestor of both neurons and immune cells (later dendritic cells). The early sensory cell thus was basically similar to networks of dendritic cell and controlled immune activity, feeding (in many aspects initially the same thing), and water circulation etc. As we become more specialised, these tasks are partitioned so that, for example, hormones are produced by special cells that are directed by the neuronal networks, which still interact with specialist phagocytes (dendritic cells in the olfactory glands) so that, the tasks of the parent cell, are now specialised in the evolved daughters. The phagocytosis was the property of this cell originally, but exists now mainly in 'immune cells' such as astrocytes and dendrocytes, mast cells and microglia, because they are equiped to deal with ingestion of large bodies, and thus have recognition of which, whilst signalling is partitioned off to neurons, and then output the preserve of hormone releasing agents or muscle cells. All these components can be found in the sponge, and in the multinucleate amoeba, the two major primitive early animal models, in various ways.

    In anycase, these relationships are there at the outset, and are pertinent to things like regulation of hormones that effect cell activity and metabolism.

    Therefore we ought to find this everywhere that biological activity is regulated by hormone releasing cells.

    The general pattern is that anything taht makes immune cells more active will trigger neural activity changes, and inflammation and oxidative stress could lead towards all sorts of consequences. In hormone and neuroendocrine cells, they will be directly controlled by this as they evolved in such teams and are designed to deliver outputs from sensory/data networks.

    It is also interesting that the major immune like cell activity I have come across in the sponge is related to the auto-immune system, which is the wing principally implicated in Type 1 diabetes. Vitamin D is the main preventative for the condition, based on the levels of type 1 diabetes in those with adequate levels.



    ------



    These ideas are released under a Creative Commons Share and Share alike license

  3. #3
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I feel very bad for having you discuss all of this highly technical information for me and me honestly being unable to comprehend most of it. Rest assured, though, that I'll work on it.

    Suppose a patient has type 1 diabetes. Based on these somewhat recent discoveries that have been buried by Big Pharma, it seems that an injection of capsaicin directly into his/her pancreas would deplete substance P and reverse the inflammation theoretically responsible for the disease, supposing the new theory to be true. Can you confirm or deny this?

    Is there a strategic location within the pancreas that would require this TRPV1+ over-stimulation? Although over-shooting the dosage a bit seems desirable as the amount of pain experienced is a constant, how much capsaicin would be necessary to achieve this? What side effects could a patient incur should he/she receive this injection, aside from short-term excruciating pain?

    If this new theory is the correct theory, then the restored function of the patient's pancreas should be permanent, correct? However, if both theories are correct, and type 1 diabetes is caused by sensory neuron inflammation from an autoimmune response, then an injection would be required every so often, correct?

    I thank you so much for your indulgence!

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,368
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    i'm afraid its difficult to pin point outside of a lab.

    Its an immunological condition with a strong neural regulation. but how far that goes in terms of wider inputs and feedbacks I can only speculate.
    ------



    These ideas are released under a Creative Commons Share and Share alike license

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    96
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I've had type 1 Diabetes since i was 11.
    strangely enough is that i had absolutely no past family history of diabetes type 1 or type 2.
    i realised i got this condition from an infection and the immune response fucked up somewhere along the lines and started attacking my pancreas.

    from what i gathered, i rememeber the day when i was really sick in middle of the year when i was 11. i had some sort of sinus infection and i was coughing a lot of green flem. i left this untreated hoping that the infection would go away. it did after 3-4 weeks. it was probably the worst sickness i have ever experienced in terms of sinus/chest infections.

    after such time, i began to show all symptoms of diabetes e.g. peeing 100x a day, thursty and etc and then hospitalisation occured when i was struck with major fatigue and then diagnosed with type 1 diabetes

    sound enough, ever since then i been in perfect health ( im nearly 19 now ) i do eat maccas everyday and eat a lot of junk that many people with diabetes wouldnt ever do, i also do/did a lot of recreational drugs, eg MDMA, LSD and i dont exercise much.... but still i try to be heathly at the same time, like eating lots of fruits and other healthy things

    when ever i went for a full blood/kidney tests, my results just came out pefect, well perfect for someone who has diabetes. my total cholesterol was 3.0 (range is 3.9 - 5.9) and my Hb1Ac was and is always between 6-7.5 . my last test which was a month ago was 6.8 which is excellent control, or atleast they tell me.
    im not typically heavy either, i weight 73 kilos and 6 feet tall

    i guess the obession i have with the glucometer has allowed me to have perfect control. i was told i was obessing a lot, since i test 10 times a day and go through bottles of test strips every week. i always try not to let my glucose levels reach more than 15. i have no had glucose readings higher than 15 for a long time, and even if i do, it drops back to normal range within half an hour after having injecting my self with insulin and going for a jog. i never had a reading higher than 20 since i was first diagnosed.
    i dont see my condition as a burden as it hasnt changed my life.. much.


    i do believe that a diabetes cure will never happen, atleast not something that will make us identical to how we were when we didnt have diabetes. as been said before, diabetes treatment companies are multi million businesses and it wont happen. im sure the the cure has been found and kept under the dark for such reasons.

    i wonder if this capsican method works in humans? maybe i can go search for a doctor who is willing to use a non-patent method to attempt to cure the disease in me.



    anyway that was my life

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,368
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    What you say is important. I believe virus infections play a major role in neuro-inflammatory and autoimmune conditions.

    In northern countries vitamin D levels correlate very strongly with type 1 diabetes. Current research suggests that adequate vitamin D associated chances of offspring having diabetes 90% less than low D levels, whilst a similar correlation has been found (maybe as high as 70% its reported) in type 2 diabetes, a proportion of which at least is a combination of both classical types.

    An explanation for why D has such an important correlation to type 1 diabetes may be seen in why ethnic minorities from Asia have 13 times the risk of type 1 in their offspring when born in the UK, and that is that low D causes vulnerability in the infant to infections and resulting autoimmune conditions.

    Anecdotally, one Doctor who had dosed their inpatients on D noted that they were completely without the influenza epidemics seen in neighbouring wards, and other research suggests that D has very powerful anti-infection properties. The impact may be increased to an infant, as the infection can trigger aggresive immune response in the mother, but also the weak defense can mean that the infection is much more likely to effect the infant, but there are other direct influences of D on cooling the auto-immune response.

    ------



    These ideas are released under a Creative Commons Share and Share alike license

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    96
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    do you reakon is possible to find a doctor/endocronologist willing to do the capsicon method worth it?
    if evn possible

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,368
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Advanc3d @ Sep 26 2008, 03:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>do you reakon is possible to find a doctor/endocronologist willing to do the capsicon method worth it?
    if evn possible</div>

    nope
    ------



    These ideas are released under a Creative Commons Share and Share alike license

  9. #9
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    10
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ATB @ Sep 26 2008, 10:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>nope</div>
    Why wouldn't it be worth it? It seems like there's a CHANCE that this plausible. Since this chance has not been investigated any further, I venture a guess that University of Toronto was on to something. I shot the four members on their research department's PR team emails a week or so ago, and I've received no response. They are hush-hush on this whole study.

    I'm sure that a patient suffering from type 1 diabetes would be willing undergo a capsaicin injection into the pancreas for this chance at a cure, as long as the only side effect is short-term excruciating pain.

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    6,368
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    yeah but there is a huge step into the unknown here. Youd have to go hugely out of your way and be willing to accept risks. It may be taht this is no more ridsky than ignoring the situation, but i just think it will be hard to find anyone with your optimism. This is the sort of thing I can imagine them trying out in the third world if they had no alternatives. The problem is you do not know that your condition and that treated in the rat are really the same.
    ------



    These ideas are released under a Creative Commons Share and Share alike license

  11. #11
    Senior Member keninishna's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    239
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Yep I got my diabetes directly after I got the chicken pox at the age of 3. I remember reading a study somewhere that took place in south america where they put t1 diabetics on chemo drugs and did a bone marrow transplant if I remember correctly to reset their immune system then they implanted some islet cells and all the study participants were basically cured of their diabetes. However they followed them for a few years and around 30%+ of the patients developed t1 diabetes again just from normal sicknesses. It'll be a little while before they cure diabetes.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Supplements for Type 1 Diabetes
    By advanc3d in forum Neuroscience/Nootropics
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: October 31st, 2008, 05:26 AM
  2. Type I Diabetes Cured...
    By chasec in forum Supplements 101
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: March 11th, 2005, 01:46 AM
  3. Coffee and Type 2 Diabetes
    By Jon Stark in forum Supplements 101
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: November 12th, 2002, 02:02 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •