alcar & stop smoking ?

**drmz** · February 15th, 2005, 08:06 PM

I have a question related to the use of ALCAR, Huperzine and Vinpocetine and non-smoking.

I "stoped" smoking roughly 4 months ago, i do smoke sometimes in the weekends and i smoked 3 days with carnaval. So in the last 2 weeks i smoked about 5 days. Not that good when you didn't smoked for such long time.

I also started with ALCAR after those 5 days smokings ( not 5 days in a row , but 3 smoke 3 not 2 smoke ). During the day i feel good, no problems at all. I take 3x 800 MG ALCAR during the day. In the evenings, after 19:00 ( +- 5 hours after taking my last ALCAR) i start to feel wierd in my head, like i stopped smoking for 1 day. Depressed, bad vision, hearth goes wild now and then and so on...

I also feel depleted in the morning,which fades 30-45 minutes after my first 800 MG of ALCAR.

Could this be due the fact that the ALCAR increase dopamine levels which "feed" the by nicotine created extra dopamine receptors, keeping a part of the habit in place by this mechanism ??

I can't explain my thoughts about this that good, because i'm not familiar with the medical terms used in neuroscience. But i think somebody will get my point ....

**Ergoman** · February 16th, 2005, 02:00 AM

Smoking combined with the supplements you mentioned is likely to impair glucose-transport, increase serum FFA/Triglyceride levels, and overall disrupt your brain and body's glucose/blood-flow homeostasis.

IMHO, the dose of ALCAR is likely much to high and I personally would not combine the supplements you mentioned because they are quite likely to cause symptoms of acute nicotine withdrawal/mild-cognitive impairments - since your neurotranmitter "imbalance" is continually "re-peated" - and actually made worse do to other unknown variables and perhaps increased oxidation. Such a high-dose of ALCAR would in theory necessitate that your ascorbic acid "needs" along with other commonly depleted nutrients would be increased signifigantly in order to metabolize the supplements you mentioned...

(I also feel a mild "crash" 5 hours after ingesting ALCAR in the evening, and ESPECIALLY whenever I have ingested over 500mg at once without the needed co-factors which you most likely are lacking...)

**drmz** · February 16th, 2005, 07:31 AM

I have a fair ammount of supportive supplementation to the ALCAR.

2x Multi Vit tabs , high dose

3 gr Vitamine C a day

Omega 3-6-9 2 gr a day

DMAE

L-tyrosine

and today is coming the L-Theanine/ Piracetam / R-ALA / Alpha-GPC and bacopa. The R-ALA is voor the increased mitochondrial oxidation because i think vitamine C has less anti-oxidant properties then R-ALA.

Smoking combined with the supplements you mentioned is likely to impair glucose-transport, increase serum FFA/Triglyceride levels, and overall disrupt your brain and body's glucose/blood-flow homeostasis.

I don't smoke on a regular basis and now try to STOP also my 10-20 cigarettes in the weekend.I don't know if those 10-20 cigarettes would have an effect on the ammount of dopamine receptors i have. I don't know what the brakedown rate for these receptors are. But i think my brain had time enough to find a good balance ( 3 months of absolutely no smoking ) . But maybe it needs longer then 3-4 months to let your brain get used to the fact that you're not smoking. Now i have the feeling that the ALCAR somehow does the same as a cigarette in some ways, increasing dopamine levels, so keeping the circuits in place which i want to break down.

Isn't ALCAR addictive ?

**eclypz** · February 16th, 2005, 01:08 PM

Hey Ergoman,

Any idea how long the insulin insensitivity and glucose issues last with smoking cessation? I have read in numerous places that insensitivity to insulin is the major reason why smoking inhibits muscular development, and I'm looking forward to reaping those benefits now.

I remember the first time I quit (years ago) there was a sensation, a bit of time after quitting, where I could "feel my meal". Meaning, I could feel a sense of mental satisfaction and I could feel my body responding to the increased carbs. When I was still smoking I couldn't feel that at all.

It has now been a month and a half and I have yet to experience that particular sensation and wondered if perhaps it takes several months to get that feeling back.

thoughts?

**drmz** · February 17th, 2005, 05:11 PM

Originally Posted by eclypz' date='Feb 16 2005, 06:08 AM

thoughts?

yeah strange ones

**nightop** · February 17th, 2005, 07:15 PM

On the issue of ALCAR and smoking... a friend of mine recently had a few smokes a couple hours after taking one of the Neurostim samples. He said he felt awful very quickly during and after smoking and complained of a headache. I'm assuming it was the high dose of ALCAR in the Neurostim.

**Ergoman** · February 17th, 2005, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by eclypz' date='Feb 16 2005, 08:08 AM

Hey Ergoman,

Any idea how long the insulin insensitivity and glucose issues last with smoking cessation? I have read in numerous places that insensitivity to insulin is the major reason why smoking inhibits muscular development, and I'm looking forward to reaping those benefits now.

I remember the first time I quit (years ago) there was a sensation, a bit of time after quitting, where I could "feel my meal". Meaning, I could feel a sense of mental satisfaction and I could feel my body responding to the increased carbs. When I was still smoking I couldn't feel that at all.

It has now been a month and a half and I have yet to experience that particular sensation and wondered if perhaps it takes several months to get that feeling back.

thoughts?

Of course this would vary greatly from one person to the next - and depends on several interacting variables, but I would "guess-timate" that your overall neurotransmitter/glucose/Insulin homeostasis/balance - would take at least 6 months to fully and optimally "recover".

Also eclypz, it was "years ago" when you first quit - and your body/metabolism etc - has changed dramatically since then - without a doubt.

This may sound like a very long time, but one must keep in mind just how potent/disruptive even mild or short-term nicotine/tobacco use can be.

I will elaborate more on this when I have some more time...

Best wishes in the meantime on your 7+ weeks of continued NOT smoking!

**Ergoman** · February 18th, 2005, 03:04 AM

MAO-activity is strongly related to smoking behaviors and withdrawal symptoms in men. In particular, MAO-B activity almost DOUBLES 3-6 weeks AFTER abruptly quitting smoking. Yet, during the 5-10 days IMMEDIATELY after smoking the last amount of tobacco, there is very little changes in MAO activity which is very interesting...

Men with low levels of MAO-B activity tend to be most likely to smoke in the first place, have the hardest time quitting smoking along with the strongest cravings and most intense withdrawal symptoms when and/or if they do stop smoking abruptly...

Looking at methods of altering activity of these enzymes may help those who wish to quit smoking and also change various behaviors in general...

I am not sure off-hand to what degree ALCAR supplementation alters MAO activity in humans, but we know that many anti-depressants change the activity signifigantly...

**drmz** · February 18th, 2005, 05:57 PM

Originally Posted by ergoman500' date='Feb 17 2005, 08:04 PM

MAO-activity is strongly related to smoking behaviors and withdrawal symptoms in men. In particular, MAO-B activity almost DOUBLES 3-6 weeks AFTER abruptly quitting smoking. Yet, during the 5-10 days IMMEDIATELY after smoking the last amount of tobacco, there is very little changes in MAO activity which is very interesting...

What is the reason behing this increased MAO-B activity after 3-6 weeks ?

Somehow the ALCAR brings back the urge to smoke, especially in the evenings, 5-6 hours after taking the last dose of ALCAR. I''m taking 50% of the dose now because my mind is running in 5 different directions at the same time.